I'm not totally newbie but my results are - about adult dating [NSFW] (15)
I'm not totally newbie but my results are - about adult dating [NSFW]
Halo everybody,
I've entered this f*kin affiliate battlefield some 6-7 months ago and still didn't make some good/medium/mwoah campaign. After admiting that I'm not that smart after all, decided finally to ask other people for feedback.
Advice is "pick one vertical, dating is good entry and also adult 'cos it converts easy". So I did: I have tried Localslags.uk, erovie.de/dk/no/se, c-date.de/dk/no/se, flirtfair.de, f-buddy.uk, milfberry.uk (some other too)
Advice is "pick one traffic source", so I did: Media buying through ad networks. I've tried Exoclick and TraffiJunky.
TJ traffic have good quality (mainly Pornhub NTVB) converts good (overal conversion rate of 5%) better than EXO (for my setup converts at around 1% or less).
TJ is OK but expensive so I can't make it work. Usually I have CTR 0.3% and with average CPM 0.650 it's CPC 0.21. For LocalSlags (which I did mostly, payout is $2.5) I have overal S/U (conversion) rate of about 5% which gives EPC of 0.12-0.13. So I'm taking loss of -40% ROI.
On the other hand, Exo is cheaper but doesn't convert. I have tried RON, then RON with category, RON with whitelist... Have run some small tests on premium placments too but then is also expensive as TJ, so can't make it work.
For Exo: some people say don't use RON. Other people say: use RON-CPC to test which sites are converting then buy from those. A colleague affiliate on Adsimilis meetup said he uses RON-CPM (I didn't ask for other parameters) and it works fine for him.
For promotion: I have tried some Direct Linking (Finch says it's OK with adult) but also that 'standard' "The Rules" LP in two versions (black and Localslags alike).
Most probably my creatives suck (have attached some as example).
Should I try other traffic (have tried a bit TraffciFactory and TrafficForce but at this moment I'm more focused on Exo)?
Exoclick traffic should be OK but, unfortuantelly, I can't make it work. Although my first moderate success was direct linked CityLove.ES (see first banner) on Exo RON-CPC (so no targeting at all except country). Volume was great and it converted 3% (overal S/U rate) off the bat, so I was break even. Unfortunatelly offer was paused next day so didn't even had time to optimise. I was not able to repeat this success after that.
So, dear colleagues, what do you think: is my problem traffic (bad placement/bad targeting) or markt (mainly UK) or offers or creatives? If creatives, should they be animated gif's, should I find better pictures, find better text/headline/copy? Should I improve CTR or CR (funnel) or try to find chaper traffic?
Or is it me?
Thanx in all cases.
Cheers,
Pedja
I think the creatives for adult traffic should be much more appealing; you should find a way to interrupt a man while he's already wanking himself
a) so you've only tested out UK? It's one of the most competitive countries in general. Ask your affiliate managers what other countries are good. I'm guessing some of the smaller countries would be easier to profit from.
b) There's a lot more adult traffic sources out there than TJ and Exoclick.
c) Your creatives are quite bad as well. You need to come up with better angles.
I think your general issue is you've tested probably 1% of what's possible to test. Ads, landers, traffic sources, countries, offers, more affiliate networks, etc.
Something I like to do is "reverse engineer" campaigns. If an affiliate is buying a lot of traffic, that means he's making money. Look at his funnel. What is he doing better than you?
What is your lander ctr? What is your ctr on your banners on PH?
Hey pedja, I'm currently in the same boat trying to get into adult. I'm mainly working with TJ and Exo as well and I have had the same experience as you with TJ converting much better than Exo.
My ads are getting pretty abysmal to somewhat alright CTR, 0.07-0.13% on TopRight/Footer front page placements and 0.09-0.27% on VidA/VidB placements. I have spent quite a bit over the past couple of weeks testing out different types of ads in many geos going with a bunch of angles such as single mothers, old and ugly, fat, hot and nothing seems to back out above -30% ROI to maybe break after optimization. As for my landers, my CTR has been hovering at around 38-42% after 4000~ clicks. My conversion rate has been increasing through lander revisions from about 2%, but is stuck around 3%.
From what I see if I could get my CTR up to 0.3-0.5 I would be making a nice profit, not really sure were to go from here though as the placements I am using cannot be animated. I plan on continuing to test LP variations as that would add to my bottom line, but it seems pretty apparent that my ads are sinking me at the moment.
I look forward to seeing you get some help with your CTR on your ads as I could use the information as well. 
pedja: Add me on Skype if you would like to throw around some ideas and help each other out.
Skype: santisoft.apps
@all, thanx for reply
@dario, @dr_ngo: I agree that creatives should be better. @pokersensei (LP CTR was about 40%), @santisoft: connecting is good
Maybe it's interesting for some people to read some background about these banners:
1st one (cleavage) is based on "boobse have great CTR" principle. Headline was taken from offer LP. Headline is in question form (one of the principles to get attention). (Traffic: EXOclick/RON/CPC/no further targeting (category or white/black list). Banner: CTR 0.05%, Offer (in june 2012): CityLove.ES/DirectLinked/CR 1.4%. Performance: CPC:$0.06/EPC$0.04) Btw: another same angle banner I didn't show (cleavage in red dress) had CTR .07% and CR 3.4% and was profitable. Also, this was crazy offer as from what I've heard so it's not strange it performed wel right off the bat.
2nd (girl from back, 'seeking slut? y/n') was based on WhatRunsWhere intel. It's not 1:1 jacked but it's combination of good ranked picture and good ranked layout (based on WRW's AdStrength measure). Original banner was animated too. I had medium through good results with this one on various markets. (Traffic: TrafficJunky: UK/PornHub/NTVB=CTR 0.41%, DE/PornHub/NTVB=CTR 0.43%, SE/PornHub/NTVB=CTR 0.44%, DK/PornHub/NTVB=CTR 0.79%, NO/PornHub/NTVB=CTR 0.68%.) Offer in Germany and Scandianvian was Erovie. Note remarkable higher CTR in SE and NO. I was profitable in these marekts but volume was low (like 50 clicks/hour). Offer in UK was LocalSlags.UK. Setup was with wel known "The Rules" LP (LP CTR was 41%). Overall CR was 5.8%. Result: eCPM=CTR*CR*Payout*1000=0.41*5.8*2.5*1000=0.595 Since bids on UK.PornHub.NTVB=$0.620-0.630 (approx) I was negative.
3rd (pick yo pussy) was mine. Based on nothing specially. Traffic: TJ/UK/PornHub/NTVB=CTR 0.62% Offer was the same (LocalSlags) but CR=3.7% was lower than with previous banner. Finally eCPM=0.574 (and bids were 0.620-0.630 see above) so I was even further from breaking even.
4th (no easier way, except whores) image was taken from Xhamster. I picked one teen with lot of clicks. Headline is based on benefits for the user (or at least: that was the idea). Traffic: Exo/RON/CPC/Whitelist, CTR=0.13%. Offer: Localslags.uk, directlinked, CR=1.8%. Result: CPC=$0.065, EPC=$0.045 so do the math. Btw: not enough data to be statistical siginificant (40K impressions, 54 clicks). I think I should test this one on TJ.
5th (handjob) was directed to handjob niche. Have tried some keyword targeting on TJ but then volume was low. On TJ/UK/PornHub/NTVB=CTR 0.36%, Offer: LocalSlags.uk/DirectLinked, CR=5.6% (without keyword targeting). CR was a bit higher with keyword targeting (have no tracking with keyword though, since I used the same P202 setup when I removed the keyword targeting from TJ) On Exo/RON/CPC/whitelist CTR=0.08% (on 300k+ impressions) and CR=0.08% (on 243 clicks)
And now about, oh so vital, TESTING:
===================================
@dr_ngo: It's fucking difficult. I did various combinations of countries and offers. I like your blog and agree with you: Basically, AffMarketing = angle x offer x traffic. But what is most important? Is it angle? If market is competitive you have a tough job to be super crative (and I'm not Mr.Green . On the other hand if offer is good you don't have to be that creative to have success (this would suggest you should go after offer first). And on the third hand if market is not that competitive traffic is cheaper but you cannot scale. Besides: how can I see wich affilate is buying a lot of traffic?
And instead of testing all possible combo's I have to find way to be more productive with testing (be able to test multiple vars). Also it'd be nice if more experenced colleagues would like to point us, newbies, which traffic source is best for testing and which one they like to use.
And what is proper order?:
1) test banners with fixed market/placement/offer
2) test placement with fixed market/offer/banners
3) test offers with fixed market/placement/banners
4) test markets with fixed placement/banners/offer
Right approach should be the nr.1 (test banners first on fixed market/placement and for one offer). But which placement/traffic is most representative (to test your banners on) and which offer should you pick?
And although RON traffic should be avoided since you don't know where your ad is published you have some other points of view too. What puzzels me is that I had moderate success with this type of traffic when market/offer was good. Also some forum members suggest RON/CPC to test banners or sites. And also some other colleagues use RON/CPM with success.
So, I think that my main question (at this moment) is: which traffic source/placment to use to test angles/cratives?
Cheers,
Pedja
damn that was a lot of shit to read.
Ok here's your main mistake.
"And on the third hand if market is not that competitive traffic is cheaper but you cannot scale."
Worry about profits first, not scaling. It's better to make $100 profit from like South Africa, than to generate $1k revenue with UK but lose money. Your goal right now should be able to figure out what "works" as far as angle / lander / ads. Once you figure it out in a non-competitive country, you can scale it to higher volume country.
As far as seeing which affiliate is buying a lot of traffic...go to alexa. Search and see what the top 10 porn sites are. See who's running the most traffic there. Pretty simple.
As for what's the most important thing to test, I'd say finding a solid offer first. You could come up with the most brilliant ads/landing page, but it doesn't matter if you're being scrubbed by a network or running an inferior offer. Split test the traffic to 5 different offers from different networks, and see what the winner is.
What traffic source to test? No one's gonna tell you.
@dr_ngo, thanx man. I really appreciate your effort to give an answer, you're a friend.
After I apply your advice I'll post results.
(Btw: after I say how long previous post was it was too late, was written already
Gonna be more concise in the future...
Hi Pedja,
Have you been able to make any progress?
@delaforet: thanx for passing by m8
Except that I've found what doesn't work, no, I didn't make progress.
Focus should be the key but if you don't see results after a while than you have doubts that you are focused on wrong thing.
Of new guys who made it: kokofai also suggest to focus. laverdureshow does great with his "unique angle" and he started with JHU offer.
Gurus suggest to be creative: Lorenzo suggest to test angels and to be creative. Stackman too. Dr_ngo to test more angles (but other things as well)
But, it seems too me that I've tried too much of my own things actually (although I did have tried to apply some of ca$hvertisings principles). Without success. If you are not creative your angles will suck, you lp's will suck and your banners will suck.
It seems that I should switch my priority to copy and adapt what's already running until I find what's working.
So I should test more, but NOT MINE OWN SHIT.
When you learn some new skill you should repeat EXACTLY that what you try to learn. When you learn to play piano, when you learn to play football, when you learn to be a surgeon. So you REPEAT first, you don't do your own thing. That comes later. Unless you are Mozart or Ogilvy or Lorenzo or Jordan or Besmir. Maybe this was my mistake, maybe not. I should split test
Unfortunately: There is no blueprint for AM (as dr_ngo writes on his blog).
I didn't find ONE (1) campaign setup that you can follow and expect EXACT (or at least approximately the same) result that you can repeat for yourself so you can learn from it and see that it works. If it's published as tutorial or campaign guide or whatever it's already dead.
So that if you do exactly this:
- traffic (ad network, placement, geo, bids, budget, day parting, week parting, frequency capping, etc.)
- offer (network, offer, country)
- promotion (lander, banners)
You can expect to have this:
- volume of x.xxx imps/day
- banner CTR of x.yyy%
- lander CTR of zz.z%
- CR will be n.n%
- and your ROI will be between -10% and +10%, or +30%, or -40% or whatever...
Everybody will tell you it's impossible because of banner burnout, because of this, because of that...
But I'm not sure. This is internet - If you want to share your campaign you can do it instantly while it's still alive.
Of course, you have directions: use TJ, or go to Adsimilis, or use 'chat style banners'. Then test and see what's working and if it's working...
</rant> sorry
and good luck to everybody
And don't give up until you have to (whatever it means)
Without reading the huge wall of text.. here are 10 steps to glory..
Adult for Dummies
1. Browse free porn sites
2. Look at ads (not at porn!) save ads
3. Click ads, look at landing page
4. Save landing page
5. Click through landing page
6. Remember the offer name and find which network has it
7. Create campaign based of steps 1-6
8. You will not instantly profit but will send some leads
9. Ask for pay bump and optimize
10. Profit
^^ thanx man
Your advice aligns with what I finally seem to grasp: after trying to be creative (which apparently I'm not) I think I should use/adapt/test/optimize another man's shit, not mine.
I'll apply this approach and post findings/results/numbers in a few days.
Originally Posted by pedja
I guess pedja did not make it? Lets have a little prayer for him ;-)
Or this was his turning point and he became a millionaire and left us guys
Home > Questions and Answers > General Questions