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The not-anymore-guaranteed method - exposed (11)

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Awww... that's too bad! Pretty clever way you figured out though

Reading through it... it seems rights holders would still be able to make codes... Probably still a loophole in there, but maybe not worth it

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Thanks for sharing! How'd you find this loophole?

Sent from my YAL-L21 using STM Forums mobile app

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That remind me of the guy, who uploaded a bunch of his own shitty 30 second songs to Spotify and has been spamming his own playlists. Generating royalties for every play that was made.

The strategy was revealed, once his shitty playlist reached global top50 and people wondered how this crap even got there and investigated.

Did you look into this kind of loopholes your self or how did you get the idea?

Of course no need to answer, just curious. I really enjoy stories how people discovered this weird tricks!

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Thanks for telling about the method, in the end it sounds like a sneaky and nice trick.

One question though, in the last thread I already asked if it is Amazon Associates and you said it´s not.
Although it´s not exactly about Amazon Associates we see now that Amazon is still involved in it so I would like to know for how long did you run the method and how often did you get paid and how much?

Years ago I made quite some money on Amazon Associates myself and it got pretty annyoing once you make more money there.
Few thousands a month with an account that built up slowly were no problem but I got several accounts with $15k-$20k/month in it banned with no payment.

Then I had to get a new virtual bank account and create new AA account and stuff with the risk to get banned again.

That´s why I then stopped that stuff because the Net60 in combination with the risk to get the account banned without payment was not worth it anymore.

And I can imagine that working with other Amazon services could lead to similar issues.

Let me quote fjk87 from the other thread

Now let me quote myself from one of the PMs I sent you

Don´t get me wrong, I don´t want to accuse you of anything bad but let me tell you how this thread could be interpreted now.

Although I don´t think that you want(ed) to scam anyone it could easily give the impression to pull as much as possible out of it before it stops working.
And when we want to go a step further it could even look like you had the same (or similar) issues that I had with Amazon and thought it´s better to sell the method for 500 x $500 for quick money instead of running it yourself, waiting at least 2 months for the first payment and still you can´t be sure if you get paid or banned.

Read my PMs again and now maybe you understand a bit better why i told you to think about it again because it could get you into serious trouble selling the stuff.

Let me quote myself again from a PM

And you can be sure that you would face a major shitstorm when you sell the smethod for $500 a pop to 500 people and none of them would get paid because the party is over before.

I´m glad that it stopped before anyone bought it, saved you and all others involved from problems and troubles.

Also I hope that you learned a lesson from it and that you should be 100% sure that your stuff is working when you want to sell it.
Otherwise it will will backfire to you 1000 times.

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Maybe it's me seeing this the wrong way, but this method pretty much is what I'd call a scam. In the very most positive way put taking advantage of a big loophole, but if you narrow it down, it's sort of a scam and let me explain why you selling this is a scam...

Selling a method that is based on scamming a system of a company, in combination with net 60 payment terms, is anything but a guaranteed income/earnings per month. It just not is. That makes the proposition of selling this method for amount X claiming it's 'guaranteed' earnings a scam.

Just because you're ripping off a billion dollar company doesn't make it legit...

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I guess it´s also how each of us would define "scam" but with your explanation and your point of view you are right about it.

I personally wouldn´t call the method itself a scam, provided he could deliver what´s promised.
Didn´t work as we see now but nonetheless I wouldn´t call the method itself a scam per se.

And that´s the next thing, one more quote from one of my PMs

I am not sure about this method and I am no lawyer at all but doing it just yourself I would say that it´s just breaking the ToS and could lead to account ban and not getting paid in worst case.
But selling it could be a whole different thing, maybe then it could be seen as commercially exploiting of a loophole and could results in serious problems.

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Agree with above guys, although I think it's mostly a matter of unexperienced, overexcitement and goodwill towards STM, without calculating possible worse case scenario's.

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I talked about that stuff with Luke and I also don't think that he had bad intentions.

But just having something "good" and then selling it for some bucks often isn't enough.

It's always good to ponder about the different scenarios it could cause and then only start selling when it's really bulletproof.

Otherwise it can be quickly at a WSO level or in worst case result in serious consequences.

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@s3ks3k and @aaaart, I learnt it from two Italian guys who had a course on audiobook publishing.

It has been a short story: I have been part of their group for a very short time because all the members were talking about buying mansions and Ferrari and bullshits, so I felt natural saying something like “hey guys! It’s nice to reward yourself, but you should also think about the value of this opportunity. Do not be egoistic only!”. I have been kicked out straight away with no explanation…. Nice dudes.


@twinaxe I ran it for 4 months and I have been paid regularly (every month), but people in the italian group were running it since the beginning of 2019 with no problems at all.
I am sure they haven't been the first ones, so the method has worked for more than a year for sure (I don't know exactly when promocodes came out, maybe it lasted several years).


I was running it by myself already AND I wanted to make quick money at the same time with the course.

As I told you in the PM, I sold my apartment last year and I gave away all the money to help people I love (my choice, I'm not complaining).
But, besides the sacrifices I had to do (I lived in a caravan for months and it was winter time), I found myself again with no good money to invest, which is my biggest obstacle since years.

I know that these are just words, but I can assure you I didn't want to exploit anyone... I was just trying to seize an opportunity which has unluckily vanished too soon (but luckily, soon enough to avoid headaches!).


I'm glad too!
But the stuff was working, so if promo codes would have worked, let's say, 1 more year.... in that case, I would have been stupid not to take advantage from it by selling the method.
So the lesson I'm learning is: be 110% clear and offer refund guarantee.
Am I ignoring something else in your opinion?



@fjk87, in my opinion it depends on “the point of view”.

Producing books is not free, producing audiobooks is not free.
Then you, have to add the time you need to invest on it (which can be a lot if you don't know how to optimize the entire process).
Then the "intellectual" value.

So let’s say you are a brand and you want to become the industry leader.

Of course you will have to invest on it.

Let’s say it’s a 1 billion/year industry. 

You will have to invest a lot on it, obviously.

Nothing comes for free, especially if you want to beat the competition.


So considering this, investing $1.000/ebook (with the exclusivity of selling it for 7 years) is not a lot.

So was Amazon being "ripped off"? I don’t think so. It was making an investment, which just became bigger than it was expecting.

And regarding the risk of getting banned (as said from @twinaxe), or calculating possible worse case scenario's (@stickupkid)… every investment has its own risk and, considering the small money you had to invest, the risk was relatively small…. Am I wrong?


Hey, don’t misunderstand me, I don't want to say I am right and you are wrong, but for sure I was not trying to scam anyone.

I hope this will be clear to everyone.

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Don't get me wrong, as I said already I don't think that you wanted to scam anyone and personally I also don't see the method itself as scam.

I would have enjoyed to run it myself

The stuff with making quick bucks or selling it because of issues that I posted above is not my personal opinion about it but it's how others could see such a thread in combination with the other thread.

About coupon codes, you can run very cool stuff with it but there's always the risk that it stops from one day to the other.

In 2009-2010 I found a way to get unlimited $50 FB vouchers for free and I could get fresh VCCs for $0.20 a pop.
These were very cool times as long as it lasted but it also went down from one day to the other and I couldn't get it running again.

I 100% agree with it.

But the big difference is to run the stuff just for yourself or to sell it or others with the risk that it can stop just 1 day after the purchase.

Only running it by yourself it would be only annoying for you, not more - not less.

But now imagine you would have sold it to 500 people for $500 each and it would stop working after 1-2 weeks.
That's a whole different reliability.
Probably then you already invested a part of the money in other stuff or bought some things for yourself or whatever.

Then the fun starts.

When you want to get out of it clean you would have to make sure that everyone gets his money back.

Or you could use a disclaimer that such stuff can happen and when people buy then they have to agree to it.
Then maybe you are in the right but when you don't pay the people back you would have the stigma to be the guy who sold a method for $25k and didn't refund the money when it stops working before people could profit from it.

So once again, I don't think and I never thought that you had intentions to scam anyone but I still think that you came up with the "promotion" before you thought enough about everything related to the sale idea and that you probably were a bit too excited about it so that you didn't really consider the things that could go wrong with such stuff.

Really man, I wouldn't have sent you the PMs when I would think that you were a scammer

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thanks for sharing

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