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Does multiple spots decrease ROI? (18)

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Hey guys,


When buying multiple spots on the same site... does that impact your ROI on the initial spots?


Lets say for example you're running a spot on Pornhub Mobile, and it's doing X% ROI... generally speaking, if you create another campaign on another spot for Pornhub mobile (same geo) with the EXACT same funnel (banners, landers) will that decrease the ROI on the initial spot?


I know testing is always the answer but I'm just curious from your guy's experience... as I am seeing a dip, but just not sure if it's due to daily fluctuations at this point (my volume is only like $50/day for each spot)


Thank you!

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Hey Chinopaisa,

It's hard to give you a proper answer as it depends if the spots are displayed on the same page or not (Header/Footer vs. Header/Interstitial). However, as we're talking about PornHub, the ROI of the initial campaign should not be affected as it's all about competition, bid, and viewable impression.

If you're worried about having similar banners on a same page, this should not be an issue as Header and Footer spots won't be visible at the same time on a mobile screen. Then I truly believe that competition is what matter the most as you may have different competitors on each spot which will result to different CPM.

You should definitely perform a test during a full week and then assess the performance of each campaign but also the overall ROI.

Don't hesitate to write me back if you need more explanations.

Have a great day!

Greg - Spicyoffers

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I'm regularly running in multiple spots on the same site, even NTV-A and NTV-B head to head But to be fair, when doing this, I always try to run at least different ads. If you run exactly the same ads and they get displayed at the same time next to each other, then obviously it will have an impact on the banner CTR at least.

The more "distant" the spots are from each other, the lower the effect. So a header VS footer is not such a big problem, on top of that, these formats usually have different dimensions, so it's harder for the users to spot its the same ads.

I'm not sure how much this affects the ROI though, the CTR effect is there for sure, but I didn't run any tests to compare ROI with and without multiple ads on the same site. What I can confirm, is the difference in performance from one spot to the next. For example a ntv spot converts better than a footer.

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@spicyoffers

Thanks Greg, you're right. A sufficient test to collect data is really the only way to tell... however, what if theoretically it was 2 spots "relatively close" to each other?

For example an Underplayer spot and footer spot? Or Underplayer spot and header spot? Where they wouldn't necessarily show on the same screen, but with a slight scroll you could see both?

Thanks @matuloo!

Yeah that makes sense the distance would impact the effect of that, and it'd be better to use different ads. I think that's the way to go moving forward...

Also, for a solid funnel, what is solid ROI you should be aiming for before scaling? For example, I'm doing about 30% ROI on $50/day spend... with 1/24 capping. Is this high enough of an ROI to "scale?" Or should on continue working on improving the funnel?

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This depends mostly on your own ROI goals ofcourse. Some are happy with a 30% ROI on 1000 euro spend a day, some need more to cover costs (mediabuy, server, tools, employees etc...).... to give an idea, we mostly scale when;
- hit 100% ROI or more
- volume is needed to keep the advertiser happy/exclusive, ofcourse don't make a loss on it

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30% on dating is good ROI these days, especially if you can keep it that way at some decent scale. I usually try to scale whatever positive ROI I'm getting, sometimes even 10% but then again, the scale has to be there otherwise it doesn't make sense. Obviously, the higher ROI the better, but we need to stay realistic, anything above 50%+ is pretty rare. You can have campaigns like this, but the scale is usually low, so for example some spots on smaller sites that the bigger guys overlooked. But when talking about the really large sites, 30% is very solid.

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@stickupkid That's really helpful thank you! Are you talking about the adult niche for dating offers with those kinds of ROIs?

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Gotcha, thanks @matuloo... the offer I was running I was notified got taken down today

After 10 months of going at it, finally hitting a positive campaign.....Man... this game ain't easy....

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Thats still awesome dude, you've seen it can be green now. 10 months too, I know it feels like a long time but you're obviously learning a tonne and moving onto year 2 I hope it blows up for you now as you connect the pieces.

I remember when running adult a few years ago, not sure how it is now, but I used to always run ads against my own on the same spots to get more traffic. ROI on almost all cases did lower, but the spend and revenue was much higher and overall profit was higher. For example:

Campaign a spot 1 - Spend $200 make $400 revenue - 100% roi
Campaign b spot 1 - Spend $150 make $250 revenue - 60% roi
Campaign c spot 1 - Spend $130 make $200 revenue - 50% roi

So yeah the ROI was always diminishing, but the overall green line was growing. But usually its best to do this when your original ad is just hammering like 100%+ ROI

I would normally test all placements on the website first and then scale whichever placement was doing best by running multiple ads on that spot, vs running the entire site placements and outbidding each other etc but some websites back then you could still do it because it was much cheaper and still good ROI, now I know its much more competitive but you can still squeeze more overall profit out placements with more then 1 campaign on it.

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Thank you @maynzie, really really appreciate it. When you did that, did you have different offers on those campaigns or were you running the same offers on those campaigns only with different creatives?

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You're welcome man!

Campaign was the same (lander and offers might of been on rotation due to caps) but I was essentially just buying more traffic from the same placement, if I bid with campaign a and get x amount of traffic, there was always competitors making profit running same spot bidding below me (they still got a share of traffic), so I just was my own competition but getting more traffic and therefore more profit but ROI was diminishing of course each time you added another campaign.

And yes ads was similar, if not the same rotation as well. But I was always using a lot of images - scaling 80% of the time with winners and rotating in 20% new ads to keep it consistent and fresh

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That's awesome, thank you @maynzie!!!

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This is the key when trying to occupy multiple spots on the same site, the more images/ads you rotate, the better.

You gotta look at it like this, as maynzie mentioned already, there are always more people bidding on the same spot, and if it works for them, there is no reason it couldn't work for you. You can actually buy ALL the traffic from a spot, just don't try to do that with one banner and one offer. Act like youre the competition, setup different campaigns and run them in the same spots at different bids.

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I don't have any experience in the adult/dating niche (only some email shoots for casual dating). But in general make sure you scale only when margins are healthy enough. 9 times out of 10 scaling means higher cost, lower ctr's and lower CR's on the offer. If you are on 30% ROI, check which parts makes this campaign a winner and optimize the "weak parts", of possible!

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I agree with Matuloo for Adult Dating myself personally haven't seen ROIs of more than 30% on a fairly large scale.

You can find larger ROIs perhaps on smaller sites and geos, but if you're talkin about numbers where you can do big profits it's usually caps out at 20-30% ROI.

At least in my experience anyway.

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Yup, thats the way I see it lately too. Up to 30% (give or take a few units) on scale, can jump up significantly on smaller spots.

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I think what you are doing here in essence is competing with yourself on the same traffic like this. What i think happens in this situation is that you are jacking up the prices for yourself doing this. I mean you are adding yourself to the competition. I think the proper thing to do in this situation is simply A/B test, change it up a bit. Opening more campaigns for the same targeting indeed is giving you a second chance to compete for the same traffic you might not able to buy last time around, but it is something that can decrease your ROI since you need to pay more to show the same ad. That's just my point of view on this

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Nope. Its perfectly fine. I buy everywhere on the same site.
But always put different banners/girls everywhere.
Even if you are using staggered bids, use different banners/girls for each bid.

I usually put my best banners above the fold, and second best banners on the lower spots.
I also put best banners at higher bids and second best banners on the lower bids.

This way you try to hook the user with all kinda baits

Of course, you do this when you scale. If you are testing don't go crazy by starting all the spots. Do testing in a very controlled and calculated way

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