Follow Along (12)
Awesome job getting your first camps up! Good work getting your first few conversions here.
I wouldn't spend any more money on those two offers, but I dare say, you could explore either of these GEOs further. Now that you have figured out how to put the pieces together to test a couple offers, try testing in some slightly bigger batches.
For either of those GEOs, you can find a ton of offers at ClickDealer or
It doesn't take much more time to set up, and you will have a much higher chance of finding winners. I recommend splitting different carriers into their own camps (as their bids will likely be different).
It can be overwhelming to choose from a list of 150 offers (like clickdealer has for EG ), but you can always talk to your AM and ask for what offers are doing revenue for other multiple other affiliates for that GEO, vertical, carrier (any combination of those). If they don't give you a big enough list, you should still use that as a starting point, then you can also supplement that with some choice selections of your own.
To get data faster, you can test in batches of 5, or if you have a lot of volume available, you can do more at once. Run each to 5-10x payout, then take any that convert more than once and explore them further (that means run more traffic; start new split tests
.
You can begin looking at the targeting and placements, but I caution you to not cut too much, early on, while you are still testing offers. If there is a placement just destroying your budget and not converting, sure, cut it, but ideally, you wait until you have enough data for your 'winning' offer. Different offers will perform differently on the same placements, and each may have better individual segments.
So say 'hi' to your AM, apply to some offers, and keep testing! Keep up the good work 
Wow Chris thanks for taking the time for such a detailed and insightful reply. Good to know to cut these two offers.
My campaign launches are currently super basic and inefficient. I want to test with bigger batches so details into how you go about runing bigger batches for faster testing couldn't have come at a better time and is very helpful. There are so many segments to optimize and starting with a GEO and carrier or two is a great place to start.
I've come across some cutting tools here on the forum and I believe vortex had a rule of thumb of cutting placements after a loss of 2x payout. I might be mistaken. Is there a rule of thumb you like to use when deciding to cut placements?
I'm working on getting some more offers from AM to test and will also browse offers for extra testing. I'll try to post a batch follow-along when I set one up.
Thanks,
Ferg
I think everyone has their own systems for organization, but I can tell you what I've been doing for direct-link tests. It's actually something I'm looking to automate soon.
I start by chatting with AMs for the networks I want to run traffic to, and get some basic lists. I then open up all of these networks in new tabs and search for the GEO that I'm looking to run.
With all this ready, I make an excel document to organize the offers with their targeting requirements and any additional notes I have. It looks something like this for each country/vertical combination:
Then I go and add all my links to
However you do it, some system of organization & note-keeping is key to juggling lots of camps at once. What I posted above is merely an example
For rules of thumb, this is something I'm still feeling out myself. GENERALLY, I cut placements that are in 2-3x loss over the past few days, regardless of how many conversions happened there. If I am buying RON at a big network and I have a proven funnel/offer combination, I will cut more aggressive, like at 1x payout in loss. I will be more aggressive when I have an expectation of how often the offer should convert, and if I know that doing so will leave me with plenty of volume still. I will generally consider placement stats only for the best performing offer or offer/lander combination (therefore you might take a little more losses on placements during your first test, but this ensures you don't cut placements that solely didnt work because you had a bad offer).
Ideally with these types of camps, you would want to focus on finding a funnel that is working well on MANY of the placements, then start cutting, otherwise you could be left with very little traffic to be profitable with. This is especially important for smaller GEOs.
Absolutely incredible info Chris thanks for sharing; you've given me much more than I ever expected. My mind was tingling with potential from your previous post and given I'm familiar with working with data I was formulating ideas of how to organize offers in a template. Then BOOM you showed me a sick way to do it; the timing couldn't be better and this is super valuable. I too will be looking to automate where I can, I'll have a look soon enough to see what export features are available with the networks and
Could you please explain a bit what RON is or point me to an existing resource on the forum?
Good stuff, I appreciate your tips on cutting placements. Can't kill the traffic too soon or there is nothing to work with.
Sure thing, no problem! I'm glad to help
RON means "Run Of Network". Technically, any time you buy traffic without targeting specific placements/sites, it would be considered RON. In this case, I'm referring to large networks such as ExoClick and ZeroPark. These sources are known to have a large amount of traffic, in mixed quality, so buying "RON" you might be buying impressions from thousands of different placements, which almost inevitably means you will spend on some "bad" zones. This is why you might be more aggressive with cuts, in such situations, because there's a bunch of "junk" you need to weed out before you find those real juicy placements.
Originally Posted by poker007
Nice documenting and reporting of stats poker007! And invaluable help from Chris - thanks and please keep it up! 
What Chris said about testing multiple offers and starting a spreadsheet to keep track is exactly what I do as well. To succeed with pop you'll need to test a ton of offers and be running a lot of camps at the same time. Without having a spreadsheet, you'll quickly start losing track of what changes you made when, unless you have a mega memory. And for the offers, each one will accept different carriers and OSs and may have other requirements - without a spreadsheet it would be very confusing. Coincidentally, I'm about to get into that in the next lesson.
Worth noting is that the next time you test offers for Egypt Etisalat on Propeller, you can blacklist that to placement that spent $3+ without converting. You'll want to start a spreadsheet to log the placements you blacklisted for each geo, and label whether it's carrier traffic or wifi traffic, so that you've not starting from scratch the next time you run EG Etisalat on propeller.
Looking forward to your next update!
Amy
Thanks for clearing up what RON is, Chris. Also, fair point on cutting things early! Can you tell me what is CAP in your spreadsheet?
Thanks Amy! Organization is crucial and I can't wait to see what you have in store for the next lesson. Great advice on how to start blacklisting thanks; the zone in question is 1096275 in case that can be of any use. I'll get a few new campaigns with multiple offers going soon and will post back!
I have a basic question, can ya'll give me a better idea of what is most commonly being referred to as vertical?
Is vertical usually meant as category (e.g., games, AV, dating, entertainment,etc.)?
For me it can be a bit confusing as there seem to be at least a couple levels, from my understanding and please correct me if this is flawed:
vertical - offer types: pin submit, app installs, sweeps, dating, adult, SOI, DOI, 1-click
vertical - categories: AV, utilities, entertainment, dating, games, download content, dating, sweeps, adult
If there is a vertical hierarchy, what is it?
CAP is where I would note if there is a cap (a limit) on the number of leads (conversions) for the offer. This could be per publisher or network-wide, and could also be per-day/week etc. Usually this will be stated in the offer description. It's good to keep in mind when you start running an offer, in case there's some low cap, because you wouldn't want to waste your money on traffic the network wont take.
It's important you distinguish by network caps (limited leads for everyone, i.e. all publishers share the cap) versus individual caps (your personal limit). Individual caps may be raised or lowered depending on traffic quality.
Verticals are more in line with your "categories" example (AV/utilities, dating, generic content, VOD, sweeps, etc.). Sometimes you may see SOI, DOI, pin-submits, etc. referred to as 'verticals', but I think those are more appropriately referred to as conversion flows. For example, there are 1-click flows for many verticals: sweeps, av, games, VOD, adult, and more!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vertical_market
^What Chris said.
I'll just add that it doesn't really matter what the exact definition of a vertical is - I use it loosely to refer to product types (like the ones Chris listed).
The important thing is that you know how to promote each type of offers.
E.g. 1 - 1/2-click offers: Carrier-traffic only, many can be direct-linked although good landers can help CR, traffic is expensive so bid high, bot traffic not a worry, can also be promoted on mobile display networks using generic banners....etc. etc.
E.g. - sweeps offers: Landers usually required, spinning wheel landers and survey landers work well, landers with logos work well but not every traffic network will accept them if you don't cloak, some offers accept wifi+carrier and even desktop traffic...etc. etc.
Sweeps is a vertical, but 1-clicks is not a vertical. However, that doesn't really matter does it - as long as you know how to promote each type of offers.
Amy
Thanks a million Amy and Chris! I wasn't aware of CAPs so that is great to know about and I appreciate thoughts on how to think about verticals. I wasn't really thinking about the offer types which was a big mistake. I definitely need to take some more time to think about the nuances of each offer type to take things to another level.
I have another question for ya'll please which revolves around geo redirection and campaign approval:
I've read that before submitting a campaign to a traffic source for approval, it is a good idea to use the ADVERTISER OFFER URL in order to limit any geo redirection issues that might hinder approval. And then when the campaign is approved to use the AFF NETWORK Offer URL. My understanding is that when you are browsing in an aff networks, click an offer and see the offer URL that this is the AFF NETWORK Offer URL not the ADVERTISER OFFER URL.
My question is, how do we find the ADVERTISER OFFER URL?
Thanks,
Ferg
Originally Posted by poker007
For example, if I were promoting a gameloft subscription offer, my aff link would look like http://www.affnetwork.com/ad-id-1234567890. The advertiser offer url would be http://www.gameloft.com.
Amy
Ok that makes sense, thanks Amy!
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