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Starting in Mobile - What a complete ball of shit (17)

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Hi Guys,

Ok so first of all I want to thank the big boys on here (you know who you are) for replying to my messages over PM. Also "Deondup" and "Kepe95" ... I have been a pain... I know.

So taking Caurmen's advice, I am starting a follow along as I need all the damn help I can get.

Alright so I am going to be sharing everything I did on my first campaign as I am sure I fucked up royally.

Anyway, so here goes...

Traffic source: Decisive
Vertical: Mobile Browser
Offer: UCBrowser - APP Install. Initial payout was $0.80 but has since been dropped to $0.40.
Geo: Indonesia
Linking: Direct Linking

Budget: Unlimited with daily spend of $8/day per campaign
Bid: 1.5 x the payout CPA goal smartCPM

Angle: Slow Browser.

Campaign structure: Following the Apetiser in general. 4 campaigns, Wifi/App, Wifi/Site, Mobile/App, Mobile/Site. 8 banners for each campaign.

Banners:


Total Spend: $85.58
Revenue: $2.80
Net profit/loss: -$82.78 (-shitloads% ROI)

Actions I took:
Well, I followed the Mobile Cookbook - Appetiser to the T. The problem I had was that it took forever to get to $15 spend per campaign. I then decided to just pause them for a day or 2.

Now what happened next was interesting. Before I paused it, it literally took almost 2 weeks to spend about $20 total.

I then decided to open it up again and just let it sit for a while. I then forgot about it... yes I was a dick and had other stuff going on like being sick, etc.

Anyway, so I open in up and in around 3 days it shot up to over $80 spend. I had a look and the culprit was "Blackberry 320x50" so I blacklisted that mofo.

Conclusions:
So I have been reading quite a bit on here while basically procrastinating as this shit is intimidating as fuck and seeing your balance just drop and drop is kinda heart breaking.

If I'm not mistaken it was Mr Green or Zeno that basically said that UC Browser is been done to death. Go figure.

So in short, my conclusion is... "fuck it" Time for a new offer and time for a new angle.

Tasks:
Start from scratch on a brand new offer, etc. Have spoken to Jon at F5 and he is helping me out here.

So consider my next post not as much of a rant but more of an informative post as to what I am doing, how and so forth.

As an "FYI"... here are my stats for this heartbreakingly shitty campaign:

F5 Offer:


Decisive Campaigns:








So I guess what I would love is some feedback as to what I can do better going forward. I would highly appreciate it.

Thank you so much.

BruceLe_ET

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Personaly I'd say your adcopy sux lol, not creatives but using word "browser" in my opinion isnt perfect because ppl dont see if their browser is slow, what they see are slowly loading websites.. laggy facebook and shit like that I think most of them didnt even think about changing browser before, but hey fixing slowly loading websites sounds better.

Anyway I'm interested if UC Browser seriously is considered dead? I thought its still doing huge for marketers

btw. you've tested only one angle?

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Here's my 2cents.
1. You're doing a lot right. You 're getting 44 clicks for a $1!! Amazing prices.
2. bidding too low causes a trickle in traffic, so that extends the time that you gather clicks. If you bid too low it takes too long. That way you never really find out when the highs and lows of traffic are. When things convert, when they don't. In this way spending too little, over too long a time-frame can kill your test.
3. You don't need to go overboard with bidding high - just a tad more could have helped you gather data in a few days, instead of it taking so long.
4. Yes, some campaigns won't be winners.
5. Those banners have OK CTR, but if they're not converting perhaps try translating them to..whatever language(s) are spoken in Indonesia. Dutch? Tagalog?

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Thanks for that But in all seriousness, your comment on my adcopy doesn't surprise me. It's definitely something I need to work on.

Your comment about the browser was kinda like an "aha" moment. I guess since I know what a browser is I just assume everyone else does as well. Silly me!

Apparently its pretty darn saturated, but I may be completely wrong.

I have only tried this one angle and yes I know I should probably try more, but I just don't know if its worth perusing to be honest.

Any one else have an opinion on this matter?

There is a "Lazy Swipe" offer on F5, but the payout is a mere $0.14 which seems like a complete waste of time... again, I am not all that sure and would value any feedback regarding this matter.

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Thanks @Auditor for the valuable comments.

Regarding what you said...

1. Thank you. I guess I just need to learn how to read all these stats as its pretty much greek to me. There was an article on here I saw right in the beginning that explains all the CPA, EPC, etc, etc but I just cannot seem to find it anywhere.
2. I used the Mobile Cookbook's suggestion of 1.5x the payout under Smart CPM. So, are you saying that I should rather try like 2x or 3x the payout when testing?
3. What I said above.
4. It's just so hard to read which ones are worth going for. I guess its all down to testing and practice.
5. Do you think I should have like 4 banners in english and 4 in whatever language is spoken in Indonesia?

Again, thanks for the feedback

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Not bad at all for your first campaign. As others mentioned, 1 angle isnt going to cut it. Within that 1 angle, all your ad copy is in the format of a questions. You should also be testing "Make your internet 87% faster", "Slow phones suck!" and other similar stuff. I would suggest starting with at least 3 angles (2 of them which have nothing to do with phone/internet/browser speed).

You have too much copy for a 320x50. In most of them, the subheadline is unnecessary and unreadable. Don't ever do black text on blue again unless you are using 'stroke' in photoshop.

You aren't showing us the most important part which are the placements. Decisive has a few placements which will suck up most of your budget namely Grindr, Hornet Gay Social Network, Bubble Bug, 6snap, 6tindr, My Talking tom and anything that starts with MSM etc. Mr.Green made a list of them here. Are you blocking everything on there before you get started?

Test some different call to actions on the banner. Install, Tap here, Download . Install usually wins for me.

Lander almost always wins over direct linking. Make sure you follow the main course next time.

Don't get frustrated. Remember that you only tested 1 offer on 1 traffic source (with 1 angle).Once you get the hang of it, you can test like 5 every week and your chances of finding a winner increases greatly.

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1. You have to learn the lingo of the trade. Otherwise you will mix everything up.
2. 1.5x payout is a good enough rule-of-thumb. I only wanted to mention the speed of the test.
4. You gotta confront those numbers man. No way 'round that. You gotta get comfortable with excel. If numbers make you dizzy, then start creating graphs in excel and visualize the numbers. This is where you make money or lose money. THIS is your business.
5. I couldn't tel you. Use Google to find out the language & customs of that country and Test it.

Also, as shakedown commented: your placements are not shown. For sure there are some vampire placements sucking the life out of your campaign. You did get a few conversions - so at least you know your tracking is set up properly.
When I launch a campaign, I bid very low the first few hours while I cut the biggest vampires. Then I gradually raise my bids, cutting and looking for placements that are giving a profit.
However, that is fine for a proven campaign, proven banners and proven landers. You have a second variable to take in to account: you're still not sure which banner is bringing you a profit, which angle is good.
The beginning is hard. But you can do it.

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Hey Bruceleet,

While I'm definitely no expert on affiliate marketing, I have ran this campaign before and made it profitable. Some pointers that helped me:

1. Translate your banners to Bahasa Indonesia. I believe if you research a bit, only 15% of the population of Indonesia speak English fluently. So you are possibly alienating 85% of your potential user base. You can use Fiverr, One Hour Translate, or for me personally, I found a good translator on Elance.
   
2. Try listing the benefits of your app that the user can relate to. "Load your facebook faster", "Watch online videos smoothly", "Imagine loading your webpages instantly" etc.. Things that the average joe will understand. Realize not everyone is as techy as us.
   
3. You need to vary your banner styles. As a picture can say a thousand words, a photo or icon can really draw more attention to your banners. It can also convey feelings that words cannot. I noticed you are only using text heavily. I love your creative use of text, but defintely try to incorporate pictures and different CTA's.
   
4. DEFINITELY try a landing page with this offer. It's a lot more work, but it made a world of difference for my campaign. In my experience and personal opinion, the landing page was the make or break point for this offer.
   
5. -82.78% is not bad.. I started out at around -75% and brought it up to about +39% with every tweak and test. You can't give up so fast. Just know that there are people with even crazier angles that are getting way better ROI. You just need to keep testing and trying different things. This offer is usually in the top 20 list, so you know for sure someone is killing it out there.

You should also read up all the information you can about affiliate marketing on STM and get to know the lingo and what all the numbers mean. Affiliate marketing is hard work man.. It's not about just whipping out a few banners, throw it onto a traffic source and watch the money roll in. You need to do research on your demographic, see what relates to your user base, how this app applies to them, and continually tweak angles/banners/landing pages. Spending money is a natural process of this. Just take it as paying for school. You are improving each time you keep going.

I look forward to hearing your successes in AM!

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Nice work on starting your follow-along, bruceleet!

I'd give the $0.15 offer a shot - it doesn't matter how low the payout is, it just matters what the maximum volume and ROI is! If the $0.15 offer converts on 30% of your 2-cent clicks, then you're laughing.

You've had loads of good advice here - let me just add one more piece:

This is a numbers game. It's entirely to be expected that your first campaign fails - and your second, and quite likely your tenth.

But at some point after that, you'll hit one that works, and that'll pay everything else back.

Even experienced affiliates don't expect every campaign, or every other campaign, to work. We just launch. A lot.

Looking forward to your next updates!

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Holy crap!!

Thanks for the awesome replies and advice guys. It has opened my eyes to quite a few things!

Thank you @shakedown. I really appreciate your feedback.

I guess looking back and looking at what others have done, it wasn't all that bad... I made something back at least

About the 1 angle... yes I totally agree. I do need to take what you as well as others have said to me to heart with regards to the copy and banners as I think this angle has some more potential to it.

Think I should give it another fresh go with new copy and new banners and a landing page instead?

With regards to the Placements... I'm assuming you are referring to the Live Reports under APP or SITE? How do I see which ones are the ones eating into my budget as all but one (Blackberry 320x50) were extremely low.

I saw the post about the list, but then reading further down people suggested to not use the list to start with as there are some instances where these sites actually hold value? In this case I dont see the value in Gay sites to be honest

Thanks again for your advice and guidance.

I most definitely am trying to get to grips with all the lingo, etc.

With regards to Excel, I love it and I'm pretty darn good with it too, just not all that sure how to make use of it in this instance. Need to learn more about that.

Regarding these placements, I used the Appetiser rule of:

"If there is an App or a Site which has had more than a third of the total spend on your campaign since that cmapaign began, has not had a conversion, and has spent more than three times your offer payout, blacklist it by clicking the "blacklist" checkbox in Decisive the the right of that App or Site."

Thats what I did pretty much and the only one there that was eating up all the money was "Blackberry 320x50" which I have blacklisted since.

Question about blacklisting... if I blacklist on one campaign, does it remember that blacklisting for all my future campaigns as well?

The second variable you mentioned is true... I have not clue. Hence why I feel I should revisit this angle with a different twist and really compare what the best ones are.

@team udon, what valuable info you have given me here!!! Thank you so much.

Regarding translation, do you think I should do 2 - 4 banners in English and the rest in Bahasa or just stick to only Bahasa? I went on assumption and assumed Enlish is widely spoken. So much for assumption, right?

The benefits you listed makes so much sense and I feel like an idiot for not even thinking about it. As I mentioned, I was under the assumption (again) that because I know what a browser is, everyone does. Silly me.

Thanks for the tips on the banners. I have a question though... how can i see what my creatives actually look like on sites and mobiles, etc? I have NO CLUE what people are seeing and where.

I am going to try a landing page for sure. Would you recommend a simple landing page with just one click through to the App Store for this?

I'm definitely not giving up... This shit works and it's golden. It's just a matter of learning and practising until, BOOM... Profit.

Regarding the reading up of info, for damn sure that's what I'm doing... its just overwhelming... amazing and insightful, but overwhelming and I'm getting there slowly but surely!

Questions:

1. I don't want to invest in Voluum just yet, so was wondering if I can use Prosper202 in the meantime as I just got hosting from Beyond Hosting?
2. I spoke with Vlad from Adsimilis (hella nice dude) and he told me to give Lovoo a shot. What's your take taking into consideration that I am a noobie?

I'll update this thread as I go along as it's motivation for me and give's me a sense of responsibility as well.

Again, thanks to all who have contributed sofar

Best,

BruceLe_ET

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As always you come to the rescue @caurmen. Thank you for the advice and I will give that offer a shot.

Would you recommend a Landing Page or direct linking on that offer?

I never know what is better for which offer.

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Ok so I went through some of the reports and wanted to ask about the blacklisting...

Would these be examples of sites that I should be Blacklisting?









Then, I have blacklisted this one, which now looking at it I'm not so sure about anymore...



I think this shit is starting to come together a bit better now

Thanks to all your help of course!

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Why did you blacklist placement that gave you conversions as the only one?

Dont look about bid numbers because thats the number of traffic YOU COULD BUY, but you didnt because you lost auction (too low CPM on this placement and someone paid more)

Look for lot of "wins" and too much clicks without conversion

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I did so because I thought it was just spending too much. In retrospect I dont know what I was thinking to be honest. Should I unblacklist that listing?

Thanks for explaining the Bids and how that works. Makes sense now.

Ill have to go over the list again and see what I can find.

Thank you @kacper. I appreciate you input.

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It's spending but its also giving you signs it can convert, add landing page, test more angles.
Basically I wouldnt blacklist on this step, you tested only one angle, test more - then from 5 angles pick one that does the job best, and move forward with optimizing.

Thats what I would do because it can be only angle issue and others may work perfectly with these placements.
So just test more angles, then find best ones, test LP and direct linking, and then cut off worst placements and search what you can tweak more.

You dont need to cut off worst placements at the end, just keep an eye on it and if you see anything suspicious like high CTR no interest in offer, or just high clicks no conversions - dont waste money.

But keep in mind you need to take baby-steps and optimize everything separately not that you see campaign is -3000% ROI and you decide to cut off everything worst.
You will lose money, but at some point you will see it was worth. Just focus on each step and test more, more offers, more angles, and dont over-complicate it.

And the most important, fuck dude - dont be so pessimistic.

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Yes, I realize I sound pessimistic... thanks for pointing that out.

Ok, so your points are very valid. Thank you.

Next Steps:

Traffic source: Decisive
Vertical: Mobile
Offers: UCBrowser - APP Install - CPI - ID ($0.32) & Du Speed Booster - Android - CPI - BR ($0.22)
Geo: Indonesia & Brazil
Linking: Direct Linking (50%) and Landing Page (50%)

Budget: Unlimited with daily spend of $8/day per campaign
Bid: 2 x the payout CPA goal smartCPM

Angles:

UCBrowser - I am going to retry the slow browser angle, but take into consideration what all of you awesome people have shared. I will be making use of more Icons, use OneHourTranslation to translate to Indonesian as well as make use of 50/50 Direct Linking and Landing Pages.

DU Speed Booster - I'm playing with either "increase you phone speed", "speed up your games", "save space on your phone" or "mobile protection" angles here. Will be translating to Portugese as 99% of the population speak Portugese. Same linking strategy will be used.

Campaign structure: Following the Appetizer in general. Since I will be making use of 50/50 DL and LP, what would you recommend I do regarding the campaigns? Still create 4 campaigns or create 8 campaigns per offer so I can get a clearer picture as to what works best?

Todo:

1. Finalize Angles
2. Finalize Ad Copy based on suggestions
3. Translate Ad Copy for banners and Landing Pages
4. Create Banners
5. Have iAmAttila and his team do the Landing Pages
6. Create and launch campaigns

Any other suggestions would be apprecaited

Thanks again to everyone.

Rega

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Looks great!

Do 4 campaigns, split-test between lander and direct link within them.

Looking forward to hearing how they go!

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