NEW Service IDEA - Coming Up With Angles For You - NEED YOUR INPUT (51)
NEW Service IDEA - Coming Up With Angles For You - NEED YOUR INPUT
Hey Guys, many of you already know I own a successful copywriting agency (8+ years in business) right.... well... I have a ton of creative talent within the company, and I was thinking why not put it to good use?
A lot of guys struggle with making banners, and landers - so we've created BannersLanders.com to solve that problem.
But another MAJOR problem is coming up with angles... well, what IF we had a service to solve that problem for YOU? Ie 5 angles for $75, or 10 angles for $100??
Thoughts and feedback please!
Originally Posted by iamattila
You should probably price this higher, however.
Originally Posted by cmdeal
PS: Clean your inbox, can't send you any PMs
Approved & Needed .... where to order 
Here's our angle service in practice, with results 
http://iamattila.com/media-buying-10...-cpi-offer.php
Now this CPI is making around $500 per day PROFIT in ONE geo All it took is finding that one kick ass angle, bidding high to get volume, and then optimizing it and watching the bling bling roll in.
Answer your pms mate, got work for you ;]
Sounds good.
You should integrate it with the banners/lander package for the super lazy among us.
Originally Posted by Finch
Originally Posted by Finch
Heh, very cool idea! Not one I'll be buying often, but I can see it being very valuable for a lot of folks.
^^ lol.
I like it! If you think about it it's basically how the big consumers market companies work. They outsource all the creative and marketing materials and just keep the project management in house.
btw, do you have a link to the Transey service? I haven't been able to find it.
Originally Posted by ricmed
What do you define as an angle? As in, here's a list of 10 ideas for angles or do you actually create the copy for the lander as well?
Thanks for the feedback so far guys.
We will be pricing this at a premium, because we only want to deal with affiliates who know how to run campaigns properly ...
The service will include us doing due diligence, learning what the offer is all about, and what kind of problem the offer we're coming up with angles for can solve.. angles will be based on that....
I am going to write a how to on this properly, so those who don't want to pay us can do it themselves & benefit for FREE - remember here you are buying creative powers, creative powers of my best guys that have been working for me for many years ... we won't provide guarantees... again, we will work with affiliates who know how to run campaigns, that means test properly, to significant numbers before cutting stuff, coming to conclusions, etc etc
Stay tuned
-Attila
Originally Posted by iamattila
We will be pricing this at a premium, because we only want to deal with affiliates who know how to run campaigns properly ...
The service will include us doing due diligence, learning what the offer is all about, and what kind of problem the offer we're coming up with angles for can solve.. angles will be based on that....
I am going to write a how to on this properly, so those who don't want to pay us can do it themselves & benefit for FREE - remember here you are buying creative powers, creative powers of my best guys that have been working for me for many years ... we won't provide guarantees... again, we will work with affiliates who know how to run campaigns, that means test properly, to significant numbers before cutting stuff, coming to conclusions, etc etc
Stay tuned
-Attila
A) how to manage confidentiality and
B) avoid conflicts of interest
especially since you plan to work with multiple clients and--if I understand correctly--you also run your own campaigns as well.
Even more than pricing, these will probably be the most important concerns for your client base.
Originally Posted by cmdeal
I specialize in cpi app and games so one way to eliminate conflict of interest is not to accept projects in this vertical. Another piece of comfort is the fact angles are one thing.. data is the driving force behind profitable campaigns.. without getting detailed here experienced affiliates know that. We wont see the client data or have access to it or what networks and or places they buy traffic so that is a suitable answer for point a.
For point b.. well.. ive been in biz for over 8 years and been entrusted with passwords to cpa networks.. ad networks of customers.. and biz secrets. The saying time will tell is always true.. i invite anyone to google about us.. and guarantee theres not one negative saying we breached someones confidentiality..
Hey iamattila, would this service be available for businesses outside AM?
I have a PPC consultants, Im currently just buying traffic on Adwords search but really want to branch out into new traffic sources, something like this might be helpful.
Originally Posted by lewis69
I see good and bad with this:
GOOD
- If you can actually come up with some really unique angles.
- This could really help the uncreative marketers out there
BAD
- Angle repeating across customers
- How many people will pay for this service
OK Guys, I am feeling kind of bored so here's the deal...
I am accepting 3 new 'review copies' at a cheap price ..
$75 for 5 angles, or $100 for 10
-You provide the OFFER. And any other info you want/have - nothing else needed.
-We will do due dilligence around the offer, determine the demographic for it, and the problems this demographic might be having...
-We will then come up with angles based on these problems.
-Angles are MAIN HEADLINES/Text that goes on BANNERS. Angles are not AD COPY on a lander, it is important you understand this.
-THIS IS FOR PEOPLE WHO ARE NOT CREATIVE, AND HAVE PROBLEM COMING UP WITH ANGLES ON THEIR OWN - IF YOU THINK YOU ARE A SHINY UNICORN of CREATIVENESS then please, don't sign up so you can say THEY SUCK I AM BETTER. Respect us who are trying to help those who are struggling with this.
-Payment must be made in advance, and then we work.
To order send an email, bannerslanders@gmail.com --
IMPORTANT NOTICE: all info is confidential, angles are not shared, they are unique to you. Also, I am not accepting angle requests for CPIs (app & game installs) that is my niche and I want to avoid conflict of interest.
Hey, do you still have a spot left?
sent you an email
Originally Posted by iamattila
However, I would probably suggest you go even one step further, and actually give a real and concrete example of what your clients will get (and what they won't get) with a made-up offer for say, a discounted eye exam or a vacation package at Disneyland.
Given human nature, you will get some people who complain publicly about your services even if you do your job properly, but for whatever reason, they are not able execute properly and/or cannot make money from these angles.
This is an area where overcommunication is probably the best way to preempt such risks.
I need your guys help, and suggestion. The original name for this service was going to be Angles R Us, then I was meditating 3 days ago, and another better name hit me - Anglesaurus with the slogan Angles that Bite!
What do you guys think? Which one is better? Or do you maybe have a suggestion for a name?
-Attila
Some other names and domains that seem available
www.nakedangles.com
www.easyangles.com
www.getmeangles.com
or if you are planning to bundle this and a lot of other outsourcing services together
www.lazyaffiliatetools.com
I am sure others can come up with even better ideas
I really like Anglesaurus. The branding kind of designs itself, too
I received my angles, the service is awesome.
You get the analysis of the target audience, their problems etc, the brainstorming is written so it will help you find other angles and more headlines.
The angles are great and will definately help me with my campaigns.
I will use it again when it's live, totally recommended
Originally Posted by iamattila
still have some spots open for the angles service?
Just curious why you'd want to sell this as a service for a hundred odd bucks when with a little extra work it could easily be worth 100, 200, 1000x what you're charging?
Below is a fictional order placed by a client who has a dental practice, and wants to get leads (Dental Tourism)
The document below is an example of the process we go through to come up with angles for anglesaurus customers. It includes research into
-target audience
-statistics on the demo/opportunity
-how we came up with the angles
-problems the target audience is having
-the angles we came up with
Target audience:
Everyone with teeth problems.
Everyone looking for a cheaper way to have their teeth fixed, anyone interested in tourism who is looking for something useful in it. People who are willing to explore other countries, people who do not have a health plan. People who live in countries with long wait times for a medical procedure.
Some statistics from the web:
50 Million Americans are Uninsured or are Underinsured. Moreover the sheer companies helping patients find qualified healthcare is expanding. In 2012, it is predicted that 1.6 million Americans will undergo Medical Tourism.
Over 60,000 British patients traveled abroad in year 2009 to save on healthcare cost. 43% of them had completed a dental treatment with average savings of about 50-70%.
A 2012 report to the Congress ‘Dental Crisis in America” from Senator Bernie Sanders shows that nearly 130 million people in the US do not have dental insurance. In the UK, the National Health Service covers only part of the dental care costs. In Australia even for people with insurance, dental work can get quite expensive, especially when it comes to dental implants, crowns and cosmetic dentistry, which are generally not covered by insurance. In many European countries people do not use dental insurance, but pay full price for the dental procedures and prices can be really high.
For example, a dental implant in the US costs around $4,000 and $3,500 in the UK. Prices can go as low as $1,500 in Thailand, $1,000 in Turkey, $850 in Mexico, Costa Rica and Colombia, $750 in India and Argentina.
Prices for dental veneers can reach $1,800 in the US and $870 in the UK, but drop as low as $300 in Turkey, $250 in Thailand, Colombia and India, $220 in Serbia, $200 in Philippines and only $150 in Malaysia.
Teeth whitening in the US can cost $2,300, but only $450 in Turkey, $350 in Mexico, $300 in Thailand, $250 in Costa Rica and $100 in India.
Patients can pay $2,000 for a dental crown in the US and $1,000 in the UK, but only $400 in Mexico, $350 in Venezuela and Thailand, $300 in Turkey and India and $100 in Philippines.
So, there are plenty of people out there with teeth problems and a vast majority of them doesn't have enough money to pay for their treatment. They are willing to travel abroad and plenty of them are looking for a way to fuse their vacation together with a dental service.
Thinking about the angles:
Teeth are one of the first things someone notices when meeting a new person, and bad teeth can trigger a reaction which makes the people think that a person with bad teeth doesn't spend much time on hygiene.
Price is very important, some of the dental procedures are up to 50% cheaper in other countries than in the USA, UK, Germany, Sweden, Norway etc.
Those who like to travel will certainly enjoy the benefits of dental tourism.
It is important to go for the low price, benefits of exploring a new culture, meeting new people etc.
The angles should aim for the discomfort of the people with bad teeth, they should hit their wallet and make the target think about themselves.
The target should reevaluate certain things about him/herself and come to a conclusion that dental tourism is the answer.
Things like better life, brighter smile, healthier smile, fear of pain etc. should be uses as angles.
Problems of the target audience:
Enjoyment of life and life-extension are very important when thinking about the angles, bad teeth are the main cause of plenty of serious medical complications and they are not attractive as healthy teeth.
Freedom from pain – no one enjoys the pain caused by bad teeth, everyone wants it to go away.
Social approval – socializing is important to the people, and people with bad teeth are always noticed and they are the ones who have problems with meeting new people.
Sexual companionship – everyone craves it, people with bad teeth always have problems with it.
Angles:
(I didn't know which country to use, so, I will use Serbia, it can easily be replaced with something else)
Your teeth are the first thing people notice! Make them shine bright at an affordable price – visit Serbia – get your teeth fixed at a low price!
Bad teeth can cause serious health complications! Protect your health – visit Serbia and return home with a new smile!
Bad breath keeps people away! Change your appearance and boost your health! Visit Serbia for a high-quality dental service at a low price!
Warning: Tooth decay will make your health deteriorate! Travel to Serbia – get your teeth fixed 50% cheaper than in your town!
No healthcare? No problem! Travel abroad and get your teeth fixed! - Visit Serbia and experience a new culture and return with a fresh smile!
Medical experts agree: Bad teeth can be a cause of major health issues! Get your teeth fixed while exploring the wonders of Serbia – Lowest prices guaranteed!
Bad teeth cause many problems! Don't wait any longer – travel to Serbia and get your teeth fixed at low prices!
You cannot afford to wait! Bad teeth will ruin your life! Come to Serbia – where professionals fix your teeth for a fraction of the price you would pay at home!
Bad teeth are a serious health concern! Take action now – visit Serbia and save up to 70% on your dental bill!
Health of your teeth is our #1 concern! Travel to Serbia and have your teeth fixed by a team of professionals for a low price!
Get your teeth fixed and save money! Come to Serbia – where your teeth are our problem!
You deserve a brighter smile! Visit Serbia and have your teeth revitalized at a low price!
Why do you spend a fortune on your dental bills? Come to Serbia – get your teeth fixed at a low price and save money!
You need healthy teeth! Come to Serbia and get your teeth fixed at low affordable prices!
Get your teeth fixed and explore a new culture! Visit Serbia and return home with healthy teeth and new experiences!
Below is a fictional order placed by a client who decided to push War Of Tanks game, and his goal is to get leads for the CPA Network
World of Tanks
Target audience:
From my personal experience of 2 years, there are plenty of players of all the ages. From 12 year old kids to 50+ year old men and women who have their own kids.
There are many history buffs and armchair generals in the game, playing the game due to their love for the golden age of tanks and world war 2.
Plenty of players play the game due to low hardware requirements, which stay low even due to the constant graphics updates and polishing.
In the beginning of the year 2014 there were around 70 million registered players in the game, and the game has broken a Guinness record for the biggest number of players on a server at the same time.
The game is very popular and the player base is growing rapidly, the game seems to be a hit with just about anyone who is fond of massive multiplayer games.
Focus should be on the people who are still not familiar with the game, ones bored with other MMO games, people interested in world war 2, tank enthusiasts and history buffs. Kids should be targeted as well due to their craving for action packed games and multiplayer.
Thinking about the angles:
Enjoyment of life is the important factor, everyone needs to relax, to chill for a bit and vent their stress somewhere. The fun factor should be used as an angle.
Golden age of tanks setting should also be used as an angle, as well as the World War 2. The angles should tell the audience that they need the game, that this game is the answer to their
search for something which will help them have fun and spend their free time. Free to play is also an important aspect which must be used, the fact that no money needs to be
spent in order to play a game is what hooks many people up. The game had won many rewards in the past, and those accolades should be uses an an angle as well.
Angles:
Register today and play with millions of players from around the world for free! World of Tanks – The best free to play action MMO game!
Relive the golden age of tanks with World of Tanks! Register for free and roll out!
Tired of games where money is more important than skills? Create your World of Tanks account and crush your enemies for free!
Good games cost money – the best games are free! World of Tanks – Winner of the Golden
Joystick award for two years in a row! Join now for free!
Become a commander of your very own tank! Join the World of Tanks and play the best free to play action MMO game!
Excellent games don't need to cost money! Join World of Tanks today and be a part of the biggest free to play MMO game!
Experience the golden age of tanks in the best free to play action MMO! World of Tanks – the biggest MMO in the world!
Millions of tank commanders are waiting for you to test your skills! Play World of Tanks for free and show them who is the boss!
Register your World of Tanks account for free today and be a part of the largest community of gamers!
Play the biggest ever growing action MMO for free! World of Tanks join the battle now!
Best things in life are free! World of Tanks – The Largest free to play action MMO in the world!
Jump into the fray now!
Think you have what it takes to command a tank? Join the hottest free to play action MMO game World of Tanks and show your skills!
Join more than 70 million registered players and play for free! World of Tanks – the biggest and the best action MMO game in the world!
World of Tanks holds the record for the biggest number of players on a server! Join them now for free and be a part of the best action MMO!
Numbers don't lie – World of Tanks is played by everyone! Join them now for free!
Just to add my input, I ordered this service as a matter of interest. They delivered it extremely fast and even gave me more angles than I paid for. It was not actually that useful for me, but if I was completely new to this, it would have been a really helpful start to the process. I would recommend this service to someone just starting out that needs a bit of help to get going.
Originally Posted by cooperoil
Appreciate it ! As an experienced affiliate marketer that comes up with his own angles, I find my own service a good addition to my 'arsenal' of creativity; because I can give an offer to my team, and have 2 or 3 people come up with angles as well. Yea many times they don't come up with anything new, but sometimes they come up with angles from a whole different perspective, recently my creative writer came up with an angle i didn't even think off and his angle helped us make around $2.5k on this CPI offer in italy
Looks like you're actually working on making the formula you were talking about a reality! -
CTRL+C
CTRL+V
or
CMD+C
CMD+V
It could be a good idea, but it is another expense for your customers to factor into the equation when running their campaigns, possibly making a positive ROI harder to achieve. This being the case, your angles would really need to be highly effective.
Well, I don't think the cost of the service would have much of an impact on ROI unless you were spending pennies.
If it's plausible to drive $xx,xxx-$xxx,xxx on a working offer, a few hundred $ initial investment is a drop in a bucket.
Interesting service, I like logo #3 too!
Would definitely be keen to try it out when the next offer like instant checkmate or battery apps get released, could make a good killing with fresh angles on offers like that 
Originally Posted by zeno
Sure, there are plenty of people who have large budgets, can scale to that level, but have little experience and/or suck at coming up with angles.
I think you're onto a good idea! Time is money and if you're able to crank out angles EFFICIENTLY then a lot of busy affiliates could justify using the service.
Your key asset will be your idea generator. Put some time into that. Don't rely on top of mind creativity, detail out some level of process.
I would put together a master template of angle/spin categories by industry vertical. For example for health you could have a checklist like:
1) Exotic ingredients from the Amazon/other weird place of the world
2) Celebrity media slips/exposing their secrets
3) Weird hormone interactions/triggers between insects
4) Newly discovered manuscripts from a long dead authority
etc etc.
Be specific enough that the list is usable and insightful, but fuzzy enough that you can continue creating unique angles for each customer.
Originally Posted by zeno
The rationale for outsourcing such tasks like angle creation is not necessarily an easy one to understand, but it is based on solid economic principles.
"One of the oldest, if not entirely intuitive, principles in economics is comparative advantage, developed by the British economist David Ricardo in the early 19th century.
As introductory econ students all learn, it explains why countries and companies ought to outsource the production of lower-value goods and services, even if they can produce them more efficiently themselves.
Even if you’re faster and more effective than everyone else at a given task — fighting with the cable company, say, or folding your socks just so — you still might be better off if you pay someone else to do it for you.
Why?
Because there is an opportunity cost for every hour consumed by these tedious, nonproductive tasks; there exists some higher-value activity you could be spending your time on instead."
Originally Posted by cmdeal
). This is one of the posts that prove this to me.
However, I have to disagree - the sencond-but-last paragraph should actually say "will" instead of "might"
. You're actually giving great examples - stuff such as cleaning the house, laundry etc. ("private" stuff) should always be one of the first things to be outsourced when you can afford it. It seems counter-intuitive for most ("I'll do that myself to save Money until I earn big $$$") at the beginning, but from a productivity/biz perspective there's now way around. The only exception I make to this, and now I'm back to the biz perspective, is the "learning" perspective.
I've learned over the years that it makes a lot of sense as a Business owner / leader to REALLY understand the processes and go through them before you outsource/hire.
a) You'll know the key parts of the process.
b) you'll be able to respond to any "Can't be done like that! / In this time? Impossible! " employee (BS or not) claims with much more clarity / authority
c) Knowing the details often helps understanding the employee worries & troubles
d) for performing on the strategic / high Level, it helps a lot to understand the operational level.
Short anecdote to b):
I remember my former business partner having to cope with some pick & pack workers complaining about how xxx amount of packages "just can't be done" on yyy time.
Ended up doing a bet: You pick & pack stuff for an hour, I pick & pack stuff for an hour. whoever has the lead wins the Argument.
My partner ended up outperforming them by factor 2.
Seems like the problem was a lot of chit-chat, cigarette breaks and overall lazyness, NOT the impossibility of "doing it in that time".
Originally Posted by bentho
Bento, you know I have a similar experience - I gave an employee of mine 2 totally different tasks to handle, and he got so confused that he ended up not doing ANY of the jobs in the end. I asked him why and he said I was unsure if I should work on one, will that mean I won't be able to finish 2, or if I work on 2, then I won't be able to start on 1 -- so his thinking, and deliberation on what to do ended up resulting in him doing nothing by the deadline.
That is the point where I decided, I am going to hire people for everything separately and have every worker just do 1 thing (by thing I mean if he's a writer, then write, if he's a blog poster then post blog posts, if he's a designer, then just design) - so far so good
Now I am on a hiring frenzy again because I am developing my business development team and customer service system for the three new spin off companies that were added as SBUs to my outsourcing empire. (Transey, Anglesaurus, and BannersLanders)
I ordered this and got the angles supplied a few days ago.
I wasn't able to go through them until today and I am very happy with the results.
First of all, a detailed report of the target audience and the problems that they might have and how to come up with angles for this audience.
For this review, I also did my own investigation and preparation and what I expected, did happen. The service came up with facts, ideas and angles that I haven't thought off.
I'm familiar with this since the same thing happens with my offline company. We always have to solve quite complex problems and if I hand a problem to solve to 3 different people, we end up with 3 different solutions. The result always has to be the same but the path they follow is different. I combine these 3 solutions and work out the most efficient way.
I will be able to do this with the angles service as well.
Angles were over-delivered. I got 28.
I will set up campaigns and test the angles. I will also have them translated for different geos.
This all will take some time though
This service is very convenient for me. It saves me time and brain resources but also helps me out with coming up with LP copy.
I could easily get addicted to this kind of service.
Are you still taking orders? I'd like to give it a go - I think I would fall into your target market pretty well, have good experience with AM, decent budgets etc but spend a massively disproportionate amount of time on the creative parts of the process. Even to see the process you follow when coming up with the ideas compared to the ones we come up with would be worth the ticket price alone, and could see myself using this a lot
Originally Posted by harlowhair
Please send mail to bannerslanders@gmail.com with offer name and url we will do all the rest.
I placed three orders and the first order came in recently.
So far my honest feedback:
- They overdelivered. I got 27 angles!
- Some angles look a bit the same. More creativity is needed.
- Copywriting is good, but needs to be shorter/to the point.
They already promised to consider my feedback for the next two orders.
Overall customer satisfaction: good!
I have not used the angles service, but one of my employees tried the banners service last service and was quite pleased with the turnaround and level of quality.
If you work/live in a high cost geography, I would say this is definitely worth looking into.
Totally agree cmdeal.
The banner service is awesome
Hey are you still taking orders now? Would love to give it a try
Home > Technical & Creative Skills >