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Running on a mom-and-pop site that doesn't allow affilates. (36)

10-15-2013 05:19 PM #1 francis (Member)
Running on a mom-and-pop site that doesn't allow affilates.

I found this great little adult niche site and after looking around I found that there were no affiliates on it. I emailed the owner and he seemed more than happy to sell me a months worth of ad space.

Next he asks what I'm advertising and says they don't allow dating sites. So I send him my tracking link that redirects to a paid porn content site.

I have to send him my ads via email, and he will upload them. My plan is to make ads that he will think are advertising the content site, but can still double as adult-dating ads, and after a few days I'll switch my tracker to my dating landing pages.

This is risky, but it could pay off because there are no affiliates to compete with. The site does enough volume to make it worth it as well.

Anyone here ever done something like this, and if so can you provide me any pointers on how to make this work?

Thanks!

10-15-2013 05:33 PM #2 budd (Member)

create a page with some info on for him read or whatever send him a link
view logs for his IP and see if there's anything unique about his useragent
if it was on same domain you could set a cookie too check for that in visitors

if visitor ip or useragent or cookie is him show clean landing page

else

show dirty page

10-15-2013 05:40 PM #3 francis (Member)

Thanks Budd, brilliant idea doing that now.

10-15-2013 07:44 PM #4 gunnersteele ()

Do the same for your ads.

Load your ads into your ad server, creating two flights - one for clean, one for the dirty - then send the webmaster ad tags instead of banner creatives.

On the clean flight - target their IP address / IP Range and geo specifically. For the dirty flight, exclude.

Now - your whole campaign will be dialed in proper.

GS

10-15-2013 07:54 PM #5 francis (Member)

Awesome gunnersteele thanks dude

10-15-2013 07:57 PM #6 stackman (Administrator)

Yep, cloak the site owner! Kinda hilarious

10-15-2013 08:29 PM #7 francis (Member)

Quote Originally Posted by gunnersteele View Post
Do the same for your ads.

Load your ads into your ad server, creating two flights - one for clean, one for the dirty - then send the webmaster ad tags instead of banner creatives.

On the clean flight - target their IP address / IP Range and geo specifically. For the dirty flight, exclude.

Now - your whole campaign will be dialed in proper.

GS
Bro I've never used an adserver. First time actually. I'm going to get Blink AdServer and self host it. I'm only going to be getting 1 million impressions per month. Can you recommend me an adserver?

10-15-2013 08:30 PM #8 francis (Member)

Quote Originally Posted by gunnersteele View Post
Do the same for your ads.

Load your ads into your ad server, creating two flights - one for clean, one for the dirty - then send the webmaster ad tags instead of banner creatives.

On the clean flight - target their IP address / IP Range and geo specifically. For the dirty flight, exclude.

Now - your whole campaign will be dialed in proper.

GS
Bro I've never used an adserver. First time actually. I'm going to get Blink AdServer and self host it. I'm only going to be getting 1 million impressions per month. Can you recommend me an adserver?

10-15-2013 08:44 PM #9 JasperP (Member)

http://www.sitescout.com/ad-server/
http://adshuffle.com/

10-15-2013 08:46 PM #10 gunnersteele ()

Adzerk

Free for up to 100MM impressions, is super-fast, and has IP targeting.

GS

10-15-2013 08:56 PM #11 clubdrock (Member)

Been doing some research on ad-servers lately. Google has a free adserver (up to 90 million ad impressions per month) but you have to apply and show them a website (your blog would probably work): http://www.google.com/doubleclick/pu...mall-business/

Also, heard good things about AdShuffle. If your not doing massive volume it has good payment options for smaller buys because it's pay as you go.

10-16-2013 01:19 AM #12 polarbacon (Moderator)

I will warn you....(kinda odd no one else has)

if and when this owner catches you, which is likely due to the fact people who use the site will complain....at some point...or if the owner is uber anal (some are) they are smarter than you think....

you stand the chance of losing your entire spend there.....


if your fine with that, then go right ahead on your plans to cloak.....

otherwise if thats money you cant afford to lose I would suggest you brainstorm better ideas...or not do the buy at all....

and lastly do you even have a working campaign? If not then for sure your on a fools errand.....

10-16-2013 02:59 AM #13 wiggywack (Member)

Something about referring to a porn site as "mom and pop" makes me laugh.

10-16-2013 04:32 AM #14 francis (Member)

Quote Originally Posted by clubdrock View Post
Been doing some research on ad-servers lately. Google has a free adserver (up to 90 million ad impressions per month) but you have to apply and show them a website (your blog would probably work): http://www.google.com/doubleclick/pu...mall-business/

Also, heard good things about AdShuffle. If your not doing massive volume it has good payment options for smaller buys because it's pay as you go.
Thanks chief. Going to apply for this. Good looking out.

10-16-2013 04:35 AM #15 francis (Member)

Quote Originally Posted by polarbacon View Post
I will warn you....(kinda odd no one else has)

if and when this owner catches you, which is likely due to the fact people who use the site will complain....at some point...or if the owner is uber anal (some are) they are smarter than you think....

you stand the chance of losing your entire spend there.....


if your fine with that, then go right ahead on your plans to cloak.....

otherwise if thats money you cant afford to lose I would suggest you brainstorm better ideas...or not do the buy at all....

and lastly do you even have a working campaign? If not then for sure your on a fools errand.....
I will heed your warning. It's a few hundred for the month placement and I'm ok with losing it.

Yes I have a working campaign, several actually, however my mission as of lately is to expand away from the competitive self serve networks that broker manwin inventory and look for site buys and placements in juicy-ads.

Thanks for this advice my friend.

10-16-2013 04:37 AM #16 francis (Member)

Quote Originally Posted by wiggywack View Post
Something about referring to a porn site as "mom and pop" makes me laugh.
Lol yeah. You know what freud said about incest right?

10-16-2013 10:47 AM #17 caurmen (Administrator)

Ad servers: I've used Adzerk in the moderately recent past, and they were pretty good. Not great, but pretty good.

10-16-2013 01:52 PM #18 gcxx (Senior Member)

Ad servers: i have been thinking about getting signed up with sitescout again (after the good old rebill days). but they are charging 8c cpm which is too much for mobile i think.. because i am paying only 50c cpm and 8 c is about 16% extra on top.. what do you guys think?

10-16-2013 10:26 PM #19 stackman (Administrator)

Quote Originally Posted by polarbacon View Post
I will warn you....(kinda odd no one else has)

if and when this owner catches you, which is likely due to the fact people who use the site will complain....at some point...or if the owner is uber anal (some are) they are smarter than you think....

you stand the chance of losing your entire spend there.....


if your fine with that, then go right ahead on your plans to cloak.....

otherwise if thats money you cant afford to lose I would suggest you brainstorm better ideas...or not do the buy at all....

and lastly do you even have a working campaign? If not then for sure your on a fools errand.....
Risk worth taking sometimes in this business. Doesn't seem like it'll be a major hit.

Just prepay 2weeks/1 month at a time at most.

10-16-2013 11:54 PM #20 craigm (Veteran Member)

If the site is adult themed I doubt the traffic is going to give a shit and complain in anyways, they probably just think it's par for the course for the site.

10-17-2013 03:41 AM #21 francis (Member)

Thanks for all the Help Guys. So Day 1 was today. I got about 150 clicks total to my ads, and switched the the adult offer 120 clicks in.

32 clicks to my Lander - 40% Landing page CTR and one $6 conversion.

I basically need 2 conversions per day for 30 days to break even.

Based on the advice earlier I got the website owners IP address, and setup a filter rule in imobitrax to show him my clean page.

Haven't tested it yet, but going to tonight on my IP address to ensure it's cloaking.

I'm testing a few ad groups.

One Ad group is BBW themed banners --> with a BBW lander --> BBW offer.

Next Ad group is Pregnant fetish themed banners --> with Preggo Lander --> generic offer

Last is shoe fetish banners --> shoe fetish lander --> generic offer.

If this goes well I can purchase 5 times the amount of traffic I have now for next month.

Thanks for all the advice everyone..

10-17-2013 06:05 PM #22 francis (Member)

Day 2

$18 Revenu and 62 Clicks to my ads. P/L = $8

If this trend continues my $10/day media buy could turn out really good.

Pregnant Funnel isn't doing too well. But I dont want to swap out ads at this point because I didn't go the adserver route and i regret it now. The site owner has full control over my ads. To be safe I'm going to switch the clean pages back when I send him new banners. I cloaked his IP range but he could be smart and use a proxy.

10-18-2013 10:08 PM #23 stackman (Administrator)

Nice!

I like these little quirky methods for making money. For all you know this could last 2 years and his traffic may quadruple. Then your time spent talking back and forth really backed out!

10-22-2013 06:14 PM #24 francis (Member)

Quote Originally Posted by stackman View Post
Nice!

I like these little quirky methods for making money. For all you know this could last 2 years and his traffic may quadruple. Then your time spent talking back and forth really backed out!
Yeah man this is turning out pretty good!

7 days in and I'm at $96 Rev.

Problem is now my ads are burnt out, I can tell because I'm getting 1/3 of the clicks I used to per day.

My dilemma is, do I send new ads to the webmaster drawing more attention to me and trust that my home made cloaker is working? Or do I let these same ads run and possibly lose revenue in the next 20 days.

10-23-2013 07:02 AM #25 Mr Green (Administrator)

You gotta keep ads fresh or this campaign will flop. If it's a small mom and pop site like I imagine it's got a small but loyal following. STM isn't a mom and pop site, but we do have a loyal following. Once a banner has been seen once on the top of the forum it's CR dies rapidly. You are going to have to convert users on multiple offers to make it work. Or run a range of campaigns to hit all users.

It seems like you are using this mom and pop site as an experiment for future buys. So keep experimenting with it! Don't aim for break even, aim to rock it. Take action on all ideas you think could make you more profit.

10-23-2013 07:12 AM #26 allthegold (Member)

Take a look at Rat Alliance's media buy case studies. They did a lot of big % buys on major sites and had to rotate a lot of offers to avoid burn out and other negative effects that come with having all the traffic.

11-15-2013 11:01 PM #27 francis (Member)

So my 30-day buy on this site is over, and they are offering me the opportunity to get 5 million impressions, for $350. The original media buy I did was 2 million imp. for $300.

Here are my 30 Day Stats.

Spend: $300
Rev: $431.28
Profit: 131.28

I was running the same ads for the entire month, because I didn't want to draw attention to myself. But the previous guy I was working with got fired, and the new guy seems cooler, so I'm going to send him new banners ever few days. They don't accept ad-servers, so I'm at their mercy.

This month my profit goal is $500 and I'll scale from there. Thanks for all the replies guys!

11-16-2013 11:14 AM #28 caurmen (Administrator)

Nice! Solid ROI and good options to scale.

Very interesting to see a different approach and how it works out!

11-18-2013 12:33 AM #29 francis (Member)

Day 1 of the new media buy.
5 Fresh Ads, new landers, room to optimize.

Spend: $350/30 days = $11.7 (estimate)
Rev: $42.00
Profit: $30.3
ROI: 258%

If this holds up all next week I'm going to purchase 10 million impressions mid month. Thanks for all the advice!

11-18-2013 03:01 AM #30 vidivo (Member)

Have you asked them about javascript tags, iframe tags, etc? Maybe they will allow specific ones..

11-18-2013 03:05 AM #31 francis (Member)

Quote Originally Posted by vidivo View Post
Have you asked them about javascript tags, iframe tags, etc? Maybe they will allow specific ones..
Going to try that, if I can control my own ads I could get much higher ROI.

11-21-2013 04:52 PM #32 stackman (Administrator)

Sick to see this working. I used to do similar style of advertising but more for arbitrage years ago and it worked so well if you put in the work to make the advertising deals! Its usually longterm too

11-24-2013 02:29 PM #33 bbrock32 (Administrator)

Managed to renew the deal?

02-06-2014 05:39 PM #34 francis (Member)

Here's an update if anyone is following this, or interested in trying it.

This little camp has been chugging along same banners, lp's and offer page for months, with no maintenance. ROI has been about 200% and I haven't touched anything.

So this week I decided to test pay per sale offers instead of the SOI i had been running for months, and to my surprise I doubled my 200% roi, to roughly 400% roi and I'm getting sales almost every day. I'd imagine the users I'm targeting have never been to pornhub, and never seen a rules lander. I'm thinking the advertiser either didn't notice my quality was so good because the volume was so low. Anyway I'm going to let this thing run for a while and it should keep doing good because it's organic traffic.

02-06-2014 05:54 PM #35 panicore (Member)

This is why i hate the lack of pps offers on CPA networks :'(

02-07-2014 10:23 PM #36 stackman (Administrator)

Nice!

I've had a little campaign running for the longest time covers almost all my monthly expenses. It's a beautiful thing when you find little stable campaigns like this

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