Email by the numbers: The things you never knew (32)
Few people here care about email, and you see me harping about email all the time, so I thought I'd show you why and give you an idea of the kind of volume I'm working with.
The screenshots below are two of the systems that I work with. I work with two media companies, I own a small part of the big one, and I own the small one 100%.
With the big one I'm sending over 200M email per year. The revenue is $xx,xxx,xxx/year. Yes eight figures.
Look at the email stats:
72M emails sent from this system
55M sent from this system
There are more systems we use, but this gives you an idea. Volume alone doesn't mean anything, look how the open rate is consistently high, unsubscribes are low, and bounces very low. The lists are very clean and very targeted and engaging.
The small company is sending about 20M emails per year and making $xx,xxx/year. I'm still working on monetizing it better.
I am shocked when I see people not making an effort to grab emails because an email address is a goldmine. You can market to them for years to come if you know how to do it. And it's free, you're not buying ads.
And the beauty of building media companies like this is that they can be sold. The big company above can be sold right now for around $40M.
If you start to think in terms of building an audience, you'll make more money by remarketing to them every week, and once it's big enough you can sell it for more money than you thought you would. Compare this with making a quick buck off an affiliate sale. Those aren't bad, but there's so much more you could be getting out of it.
The email game is very hard; it's like learning AM all over again. But it's also very rewarding.
Good luck! carpe internet monies!
Thanks so much for posting this!
I'm new to AM entirely, I was turned onto it by an Entrepreneur who made his millions by using AM Landing Pages to collect emails and build lists. I recall him saying how many Affiliate Marketers forget how much money can be made on the backend.
It was a concrete goal of mine to implement list building into my campaigns.
This re-affirms the potential 
Cool, i just want to know how to get email lists? google, facebook or media buy? i think they are the same with affiliate maketing on grab email lists.
Those numbers are delicious. Personally I have never collected emails, I know I have left a lot of money on the table by not doing so...grump.
As an email hardcore fan, thanks for this! The money is on the list
Originally Posted by johnathanta
I'm new to AM entirely, I was turned onto it by an Entrepreneur who made his millions by using AM Landing Pages to collect emails and build lists. I recall him saying how many Affiliate Marketers forget how much money can be made on the backend.
It was a concrete goal of mine to implement list building into my campaigns.
This re-affirms the potential
Originally Posted by vokesdil
Originally Posted by Mr Green
The beauty of email is that there's no guessing, it's guaranteed monies. I can launch a campaign right now that's sure to only make money, the only question is how much. But the hard part is building up a list.
If you created a simple guide for getting starting in email with standard Do's and Don'ts then I would make it rain 'Thanks' on you forever.
Do you focus on a single niche and blast it to the maximum, or is this a collection of many smaller scale campaigns across the spectrum?
Inspiring stuff, brings meaning to the term 'scale'.
Also - what do you make of the changes to Gmail with certain mail getting shifted to the Promotions tab?
How do you monetize them? Do you just collect the emails from a certain niche campaigns and then just blast the list with loads of offers in the same niche over a long period of time?
I've seen gurus teaching email list "methods" and I was kind of turned off by the idea. A lot of them promoted building a crap wordpress site with lots of PLR articles that collected email subscribers and then marketed repackaged PLR products to them. Seemed kinda amateurish.
Awesome post! Email's massively undervalued - I've been meaning to expand my listbuilding efforts for a while, and you've just added fuel to the fire there...
Originally Posted by allthegold
Originally Posted by Finch
Let's say you had a list of 10,000 people you know are into gaming. You create a newsletter than brings value to those people, then sell your product or insert affiliate ads. For example:
August Newsletter: Best Saints Row Videos; GTA V Exclusive Preview
The opportunity to monetize this is high, but you have to be creative. You must produce good content, and you'll be able to run affiliate offers, or go direct when you get big. For example, in the big media company above, we have a direct advertising relationship with a company that is among the top 10 biggest in the world.
You can build up a list and email it regularly - I'm sure you can imagine the potential as your list grows. Same with dating, you can market someone's ebook or write your own if you know how to get them shawtays.
It's important to remember you can't just blast people with offers, you have to cultivate the relationship by bringing value to their lives and serving up juicy content they'll love. It's a different mindset than AM where it's wham-bam-thank you ma'am, you're just trying to maximize profits and don't care much about the person on the other end.
Originally Posted by davidal
The people who stand to profit quickly and furiously from email right now are the affiliates who could be gathering thousands of emails, but just don't because they don't know what to do with them.
What are your suggestions for an ESP?
We have previously used the usual services - aweber, icontact etc - and although DOI'd, have always ended up booted fairly rapidly due to exceeding complaint threshold, although marginally. Our buyers lists are fine, but it's users who have opted in from an exit pop that we have been unable to monetize because of aforementioned issue.
Originally Posted by ratalliance
noob's ESP aka sucker's ESP: mailchimp, icontact, etc. These are the ESPs that do everything for you, make sending very easy, but charge you outrageous fees like 1c/email. At that rate, 10M emails would cost you $100,000. Obviously these are for smalltime senders. No one who sends any significant volume uses these.
Midlevel ESPs: Platforms like SendGrid, which offer transactional rates like 10c/1,000 emails, though they try to suck you into a premium plan where you pay $1/1,000. 10M emails would cost you $10,000.
Enterprise level ESPs: These are platforms that charge you by list size, you get unlimited sending. They provide very advanced segmentation, tracking, analytics, etc, so that's what you're really paying for. I've paid high $x,xxx before for a single advanced analytics license. These platforms cost $100,000 for a list of 1M contacts for example. I use two of these platforms. One of them is the exact same one that American Express uses, to give you an idea of the power behind it. I don't want to name any, but search and you will find.
Affiliate's Dream ESPs: Setting up your own dedicated or VPS server, installing the software on it, configuring it, etc. Requires technical knowledge of mail servers. I run several of these. They are very cheap: for $50-$500/month you can get unlimited mail pretty much.
Note that if you spam, none of the options above will work for you. You will be banned very quickly.
FAQ
I'd love me some email monies! How do I build a list?
If you're an affiliate generating traffic, find a way to capture the email and email them based on their interest. There are other ways but for our intents and purposes that's the best way for affiliates. Definitely never buy lists.
OK, I got a ton of emails, what now?
See how others are dominating your niche with emails, and do better. For example, in the dating space, a lot of people are sending well-crafted emails offering advice on dating (pua, etc) and selling $xx ebooks, $x,xxx bootcamps, etc. Be creative.
But I'm lazy/illiterate, how do I find great content?
Hire someone. We have more than 10 full-time writers at the big company, and I have one for the small company. Look at it this way: If you send a $5 article to 10,000 people, you might make $20 out of it. But if you send them a $50 article, you might get $500 and it'll get passed around, which gets you even more subscribers. There are sites where you can find writers for hire and pay per article.
Oh no this is too hard I just want some quick monies!
There is no way to get rich quick with email. People are usually very suspicious, it might take a few emails before they even click on your links. They will trust you if you appear to be producing high-quality content. Again, let's say you have a dating list, you can produce some content about 'How to meet quality women using speed dating' or '5 ways you can double your response rate on POF' and offer real information. These are just bad examples off the top of my head, I'm sure you're a lot smarter than I am. Once people trust you, you can market to them more and more.
Remember to stop thinking like an affiliate looking to make a quick $2 per person. If you build a decent audience, they will read your content for years, and you will generate $xxx per person over the lifetime of their subscription. New things become possible, like launching your own products, JVs, etc. Understand that it is possible to simply blast people directly with offers, but you'll burn through those leads very quickly.
Let's say you build up a huge list of 1M emails. They are engaged and you market a $25 ebook to them, and 0.1% buy. That's $25,000. Let's say you maintain that once a week over one year. That's $1.25M and you've only converted 5% of your list on a single product. Email is a more intimate medium and enjoy very high conversion rates.
At the end of the day, email is simply another channel. Those who are creative will find a way to milk it.
Originally Posted by _mcr_
We've been around a lot longer then that. And there's a lot of bulk mailers that mail 8-9 figures a year as well.
Just a VERY VERY different game. 100's of thousands of IP's and Tech vs. carefully crafted content.
All depends on what your strong suit is. The uber nerdy anti-social tech guy often times isn't the best copy writer and the best copy writer isn't the best tech guy. Go to your strengths.
Or partner/hire someone with those strengths you don't have.
We bulk mail with tons of IP and massive lists. And have dabbled back and forth in newsletter mail as well. All take a ton of time, dedication and resources. Pick your path wisely. And once you're spread to thin start to hire.
P.S. Awesome post _mcr_
I have a question regarding the recent changes on how Gmail displays the inbox. Did this change hurt your opening rates?
Smaxor, I agree and am aware of what you're talking about. That's also why I said above that for our intents and purposes getting email submits is the only way. Truth is you and I can scrape, spam, etc, and get away with it. I didn't want people here to get too excited and start doing those things and get in trouble. The content route is safer for beginners.
Originally Posted by menocco
Hey _mcr_,
Thanks for the great thread! Email is something I've wanted to get into for quite some time. Do you tend to email SOI or DOI?
I currently collect a large amount of SOI a day & then follow them up with a DOI email so I know if their interested or not. What would your advice be for the people who don't DOI? Should I just follow up with some quality content & try drive them to DOI or follow up with some offers regardless?
I personally never both with double opt-in. If you have their email, and know their interest, assume they're interested. From there on out there are two possibilities:
- nurture them softly and tenderly with high-quality content, and keep them subscribed for years. You make money over a long period of time and you build an asset.
- blast them harshly and brutally with offers like Smaxor said, but you'll burn through your leads quickly. It'll require you to keep changing servers because you'll get banned and exposes you to potential legal trouble if you're in the US and this thing catches up to you. If you keep reblasting your list you're essentially not letting them unsubscribe so you're violating the CAN-SPAM Act. I'm sure it can be hugely profitable though. I've just never tried this particular approach.
Originally Posted by river
I think you have caught everyones interest Would love to hear more about how you started as well
Originally Posted by Smaxor
Originally Posted by Dutch David
Would love to hear more about how you started as wellI'm not experienced in AM however, and I see a lot of people who are AM ninjas but have never done email.
The approach I followed is the content approach I explained above. Never spammed, so I couldn't tell you what's involved with that strategy, but I can imagine how someone with experience would make it work.
uh oh the e-mail game is in the spotlight!
edit: looking forward to more e-mail tips, and the e-book also!
Another quick update, have you heard of that 'custom audience' thing that Facebook is now doing that allows you to target your own customers? Been doing that with email for a while. I signed up with a major network I'd rather not name as a data provider. A network is not the same thing as in AM, it's a specialized agency that sits just below Google for example, and helps optimize ad serving. Here's how it works in a nutshell:
All links in a newsletter contain the hash of the subscriber's email, along with other relevant data, like their industry, title, company size, etc. Their privacy is protected because I am not revealing their identity. I pass these variables anonymously. The network can then cookie them and match them up with ads relevant to their interests. For example, an accountant will see an ad for Intuit software, which they're more likely to click on. I receive 20% of the CPC regardless of where the click happens, as long as it's a site that belongs to the network. For example, let's say they look at my newsletter, they click a link and read an article and go away. A week later, they visit some other site, and the site uses MY DATA to decide they're an accountant, so the network serves up an Intuit ad, and they click. I get 20%.
Isn't it a beautiful concept?
So much potential with email, if you only knew! OF course this is a bit more advanced email marketing, it requires a curated database with more than just an email address. Just posting this to show you the monetization potential out there is very vast. Why do you think Facebook is jumping on the email hash bandwagon!
That's a snapshot from a campaign I sent out yesterday. Nice things come to those who nurture their lists. Look at the opens and CTR. Most of the clicks go to the juicy content I send them, and a portion of them go to ads in the newsletter. Those who don't click on ads in the newsletter, click on ads in the site. Those who don't click any ads or buy anything this time, well, there's always next time. As long as I got them in my list, I can nurture the leads for a long time to come. Nothing is lost.
Note: the bounces are not 0, but they're extremely low. They are processed somewhere else so they don't show on that page.
Great post, MCR. A few questions...
1. What are the ad platforms you recommend to build lists? Which ones do you discourage using because they are not profitable?
2. How much should be way paying per click (ballpark) to build our lists?
3. I have a list in a niche but I want to sell them a completely different product from another niche. Can this be done and how does one do it?
4. Do you think it's possible to sell a paid newsletter? If so, what niches do you think would work best?
Very cool man, thanks for sharing.
This is an area of the industry i almost never see, so it was cool to see some figures.
This post + this post where the blake has 5mil followers are reiterating the longterm potential of branding+affiliate marketing!
Originally Posted by paycoguy
2. I pay nothing per click right now. I have a "circulation team" who builds lists all day. 2 US employees and 11 VAs. All they do all they is, ahem, collect data. They collect people's email along with name, title, industry, etc, etc. Those complete records are extremely valuable. I am looking into paid traffic because it's much faster. For the intents and purposes of affiliates, I recommend keeping it simple and just collecting emails from the traffic you're already runnning.
3. Not sure. I haven't tried this particular approach, but if you know your audience well, and they trust you, good things can happen.
4. Paid newsletters exist in certain industries like finance. You have to be a respected authority in your field and provide something insanely valuable. So yes, for example Warren Buffett can do a paid newsletter, and people will pay for it.
^^ stackman got it right, it's about building a brand, not just one-off blasts hoping to make a quick sale.
Which software do you recommend when creating your own ESP on your own dedicated server?
Originally Posted by mora
This post needs urgent updating! 
Would love to hear how it is going today. We are still big email fans and see email as the big opportunity for affiliate marketing while lots of affiliates are looking into different tools like display, social,...
Cheers!
Maester
Damn, such an old thread over here and the info is till up to date. But the point is that mostly affiliates tend to underestimate the potential of email traffic (and sms) in 2020 as well as in 2013. Though it looks like push notifications trend has changed the game a bit. It's been much easier to collect and monetize push notification subscribers than email subscribers (less infrastructure and investments needed). And once you tried to own some traffic, you get the point Currently email and sms traffic works really awesome for cc submit sweepstakes (we're 100% focused on that vertical) and I bet for almost any other vertical as well. I wish we paid more attention to those sources when we launched our network in 2017.
In the meanwhile, it would be great to learn what veterans think of email/sms traffic then and now. Could anyone involved in working with those sources for a long time share your opinion on that?
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